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DaretothREdux (39.76)

Deserted Island Government

Recs

23

November 17, 2009 – Comments (29) | RELATED TICKERS: GOV , ERN

You and 100 other people are stranded on a deserted island. You get to choose the professions of the 100 people.

Note: If it makes more logical sense to you to say that you intentionally stranded yourself along with the 100 people, then feel free think of it that way.

Now. You are dictator for a day. You must establish a government, hopefully one that compliments the 100 people with you. You can make as many or as few laws as you see fit. You can have a constitution or not. Your choice.

Note: The Island has substantial resources to sustain you and all 100 people for at least the next 10,000 years if used effectively.

Now GO!

Leave your rec in the top right corner and you Government in the comments section. Later today, I will give mine, but I am really interested in hearing from everyone, no matter your political or apolitical leanings.

Dare

29 Comments – Post Your Own

#1) On November 17, 2009 at 9:26 AM, chk999 (99.97) wrote:

Ninety-nine supermodels and me. At least one of them knows how to brew beer.

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#2) On November 17, 2009 at 9:49 AM, lemoneater (81.66) wrote:

It's hard to improve on Gilligan's Island. Of course now we know that was a sinister plot. Thanks to whomever posted the expose a few days ago.

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#3) On November 17, 2009 at 10:28 AM, DaretothREdux (39.76) wrote:

Don't be shy people! Someone take the plunge....at least     Chk999 made an attempt at humor...

Dare

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#4) On November 17, 2009 at 11:08 AM, TMFCrocoStimpy (95.59) wrote:

Humor?  I'm sure that chk999 was dead serious.

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#5) On November 17, 2009 at 11:39 AM, DaretothREdux (39.76) wrote:

The lines remain open, we are taking your calls NOW!

The 8th caller will recieve a prize!

Dare

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#6) On November 17, 2009 at 11:47 AM, thongpatrol (< 20) wrote:

no constitution.  it will be outdated within days.  10 people who know how to craft beer and wine, 10 people who can cook their butts off, 20 people who will clean, 10 people who will make clothing, 30 people making other stuff (thongs, mine materials, toilet paper, toilets, plumbing, transportation, communications, entertainment, etc), 10 people making sure everything runs smoothly, and 10 gorgeous women for procreation.  this is utopia.  laws will be created to protect others (safety and health). 

there is no satire in my government.  

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#7) On November 17, 2009 at 11:55 AM, whereaminow (20.95) wrote:

Dare,

How can we have a government if 

1.  We don't have anyone to hate (please identify an enemy for me - either a superevilgod or a scary foreign people)

2.  We have no one to subjugate and/or steal from. (again, list all of the possible people and tribes we may rob from, so that we can organize as a looter society).

And I'm totally serious too, because that is how governmnets originated.  

David in Qatar

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#8) On November 17, 2009 at 11:58 AM, catoismymotor (38.39) wrote:

I am taking the approach to this assignment that I am on this island with 100 others that choose to be there and are motivated to start fresh, like Jamestown but without having to worry about native tribes and enriching a group of investors thousands of miles away. My 100 have money, connections, education and the drive to make things happen.  

 

Welcome to Catovania!!! 

 

I would establish Catovania as a representative republic. The backbone for the laws of my islands nation would be the United States Constitution and Bill of Rights. When both of these documents are used little is left to go wrong.

 

I would establish the following seven departments that would be designed to expand and protect the quality of life of Catovanians: 

 

Department of Perseverance: This would behave like a cross between the Environmental Protection Agency and the United States National Park Service. I believe we should behave as stewards of this planet and treat it as well as we can. A portion of the wild areas of the island would be set aside to be as they have always been.

 

Department of Infrastructure: This would be responsible for highways, surface streets, sewer, electrical and natural gas infrastructure. This department will also oversee the maintenance of the ports and airports. All providers of services would be privatized but construction and maintenance is by the department because all are deemed to vital to national security interests.

 

Department of Foreign Relations, Business and Trade Development: This would act as the international branch of good will.  It would seek out and foster relationships with trading partners. It would only exist to expand trade and relations. This department would also be in charge of issuing visas and passports.

 

Department of Law and Justice:  This department would hold the National Prosecutor’s office (Attorney General), Supreme Court, Congress and Senate.

 

Department of Civil Defense: This would act as a combination of fire department, police department and coast guard.

 

Department of Currency:  Catovania would operate on the gold standard. This department therefore would behave as a kind of national vault. It will be protected by the Dept. of Civil Defense. Think of Ft. Knox in Kentucky. The Department of Currency would also keep US dollars, UK pounds, Euros and Yuan’s on hand in some number that makes sense in order to make it easier for the islands business people to conduct business in hard cash with foreigners.  

 

Department of Sales Tax Collection: The island would operate on the Fair Tax (fairtax.org). There would be no income tax or payroll tax. All taxes would be paid at the time you purchase a good or a service. This department’s sole purpose would be collecting the sales tax from the island’s businesses in order for the government to pay its bills. Ideally this system of taxation would make Catovania a tax haven for foreign businesses. I would plan to operate the island on a budget that would allow for a tax rate of 10%, maybe less.  

 

Oh, one last thing: In order to vote or run for office you must be at least twenty eight years of age. You can drink, smoke and drive a car at eighteen, should you choose. I believe once you hit thirty you’ve gone through enough “life” to be capable of making better, more thoughtful decisions. 

 

Oh, really the last thing: My island would not have any prisons. All convicted felons will be incarcerated in Mexico. We will compensate Mexico for their hospitality. Very few misdomenors would result in jail time. Punishment for those would be hundreds of hours of community service working really smelly, dirty difficult jobs.

 

 Many of my ideas are half baked, I know. I am not of the same ilk as Thomas Jefferson or John Adams. Plus I am purely working out of my own head and am not cheating by using the internet to lift the ideas of others. Report this comment
#9) On November 17, 2009 at 12:02 PM, DaretothREdux (39.76) wrote:

thongpatrol,

10 people making sure everything runs smoothly

What exactly would that entail?

David,

So....anarchy? What of the rule of law? Remember I asked what laws there would be as well? I do agree with you about the origin of Government though. So, in a world of peace and absolute free trade, is there a need for goverance of any kind?

Dare

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#10) On November 17, 2009 at 12:07 PM, catoismymotor (38.39) wrote:

David,

In my idea my 100 are motivated. By what? Let's say oppresive taxes and the nanny state that follows. For me that is enough to satisfy your #1. And as far as #2 goes the island would loot by enticement by using the Fair Tax to lure companies from around the world to set up HQs in Catovania. Yo-ho, me hearties!

Catolicious, Supreme High Poobah of Catovania

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#11) On November 17, 2009 at 12:33 PM, lemoneater (81.66) wrote:

I agree with Cato that I want the Constitution and Bill of Rights. Why re-invent the wheel?

However, rather than hypothetical people I would populate the Island with CAPs members (and a few of their family members). Surely we have enough local talent. The talents I bring are as follows: I can identify many plants as to whether they are edible or poisonous, I can do hand weaving and crocheting. I know how to grow cucumbers, sweet corn and tomatoes. I can also make beautiful jewelry.

I'm married to the Professor (for real). He has a patent. Every island needs an inventor :) Not to mention that he enjoys making dulcimers and penny whistles. 

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#12) On November 17, 2009 at 12:38 PM, whereaminow (20.95) wrote:

DaretothREdux,

There's a need for an arbitrator of disputes, but no collective governance.  Government is barbaric, slow to react, and anti-social. 

But in your example I have to make some assumptions.

First, these are families and not individual lonely single men.

Second, there is enough land for everyone (you did say there were abundant resources.)

If that's true, there is no need for government at all.  If there is enough land for every family, everyone will farm.  No one will work for another if there is enough land to sustain his own family.  If no one can farm, you're in big trouble anyway.  

The closest example would be the frontier in America, only remove the threats caused by the constant fighting between the tribes and the various governments (British, French, American) that kept trying to steal their land.  

David in Qatar

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#13) On November 17, 2009 at 1:17 PM, DaretothREdux (39.76) wrote:

David,

There's a need for an arbitrator of disputes, but no collective governance.  Government is barbaric, slow to react, and anti-social. 

This is what I was looking for you to say. I already knew this is what you meant, but other's reading what you wrote might wonder about the rule of law, property rights, and such. After all, land isn't the only thing people can envy. Someone else might have a better rake than me that he invented, and even if resources are abundant, I don't have a right to his rake, do I?

Dare

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#14) On November 17, 2009 at 2:24 PM, nzsvz9 (< 20) wrote:

Dare,

An interesting philosophical challenge.

Although many of the proposed institutions proposed by catoismymotor are tending to the current political thinking (some quite unconventional) I would liken Catovania (sp?) to a more moderated version of the systems and policies we have today. Government, taxation, departments of this and that - although the allure of the gold standard and fair tax are nicer forms of the institutionalized theft and brigandry we have in government today. Compred to what we have, Catovania sounds quite nice.

That said, it is not what I would choose to implement. In the time it would take to instititute any government the collective 100 would begin to decline in population - and the not-so-inclined to polite society would undoubtedly start to assert themselves by force - bikini clad supermodels taking over notwithstanding.

But, if I can leave the "Lord of the Flies" scenario aside and work with cooperative persons, likeminded and "civilised" -- then my approach would be one of proposing the following:

We the people of this island agree on our sacred honor to live our lives as free persons, at all times abiding by common law, establish this Constitution in order to provide for the common defense (perhaps against Cataovania) established this day.

(large section on common law, how to set up a court from among the 100, only trial by jury, Bastiat sort of stuff) 

(large section on what common defense means - another subject perhaps - another large section on how to meet to determine if there is a threat to our island - and what to do about it. No one could be compelled to participate or contribute to the common defense - it would be voluntary)

Oh, and our island motto would be "Trust in God, but lock your car" (from Life's Little Instruction Book II)

There would be no taxation - no establishment of currency - no compulsory laws (i.e. you must buy this or that insurance, only go so fast, wear a helmet) no drug laws, no education law, that would all be left to the free market.

Known by starving neghboring islanders as freeman nzsvz9

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#15) On November 17, 2009 at 2:28 PM, whereaminow (20.95) wrote:

Dare,

I think whenever someone tries to defend the institution of government, whether it's a massive social democracy or a night watchman's state, there is going to be a failure of logic.

In any other aspect of our society, people who provide a valuable service - whether it is security, charity, medicine, message delivery, product testing, you name it - they succeed without using coercion.  Their services are demanded and people are willing to trade for them.

Only the government must exist through coercion.  Think about this.  If the government's services are really that valuable, why do they have to force us to pay for it?  Every time tax raises are put to a referendum, they lose.  Yet, taxes always go up, eitther directly or indirectly.  Why?  If the service is so freaking great, tax raises should always win referendum and the government wouldn't have to legislate at all. We'd all be happily giving away more and more money.  Even the worst McDonald's burgers are desired over government service.

The argument is that we're stupid. We just don't know any better. We can't decide these things for ourselves.

This is an understandable counter argument when we consider where government comes from. Throughout history, it has always been the superior race (if they won, guess what... they were superior... in their eyes... which since they are now in charge..... is all that matters), the one that conquered, that assumes a higher calling for itself. 

Only in recent history has there been any thought to the idea that the people might have brains too.  But then we started posting our thoughts every day on Facebook and we realized that we're pretty freaking stupid too.  Oh well. 

David in Qatar

 

 

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#16) On November 17, 2009 at 3:30 PM, ChrisGraley (29.72) wrote:

There will be no taxes on my island, we will run our entire economy by shorting the US dollar and hoarding precious metals.

I like the 99 model idea, so I'll go with that, but It will only be 98 models. I will always dress in a white suit and the 99th person will be my dwarven sidekick that I'll call Tatoo.

We will sacrifice criminals to the volcano.

Also there will be a miniature golf course, although I'm unsure why.

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#17) On November 17, 2009 at 3:49 PM, catoismymotor (38.39) wrote:

#14 - Catovania has an immune system style defense force. It has a police force, fire department and a coast guard. No army or navy. Our island is about peace through commerce and prosperity through individual liberty. There is nothing to fear from us. We would however have strong allies willing to do the dirty work for us. *evil laughter*

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#18) On November 17, 2009 at 3:52 PM, catoismymotor (38.39) wrote:

#16 - As the 24 hour dictator of Catovania I hereby grant you diplomatic status and a super-awesome passport/iPod combo.

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#19) On November 17, 2009 at 4:55 PM, outoffocus (22.80) wrote:

10 people who can cook their butts off,

But then what would they sit on?

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#20) On November 17, 2009 at 5:59 PM, thongpatrol (< 20) wrote:

Dare,

you want to overthrow the government.  stop with these nonsense exercises. This is your true ambition.   how do you propose to do this?  80% of the people in this country are idiots.  you should be able to attract a lot of followers.  

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#21) On November 17, 2009 at 9:50 PM, outoffocus (22.80) wrote:

80% of the people in this country are idiots.  you should be able to attract a lot of followers.  

Not really.  I think the dems and repubs got the idiot market cornered. Besides, in order to get followers u need control of the media, which Dare doesnt have. 

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#22) On November 17, 2009 at 11:57 PM, FleaBagger (29.25) wrote:

K.I.S.S.

chk999's answer is good, but I want to specify that at at least ten of them know how to cook, at least twenty know how to garden, at least ten know how to hunt, and not one of them knows how to make clothes. ;)

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#23) On November 18, 2009 at 12:36 AM, starbucks4ever (97.71) wrote:

I would try to approach it in a practical manner. So my list would run like this (professions are listed in the order of importance).

1. Sheriff.

2. Prison ward.

3. Private detective.

4. Security guard.

5. Professional politician 

6. Professional political campaign organizer

7. Public relations specialist.

8. Newspaper editor.

9. Clergyman.

10. Entertainment specialist. 

11. Boat maker so I can escape from the island when food runs out. 

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#24) On November 18, 2009 at 1:38 AM, scoobamang (< 20) wrote:

There are currently 7.88 acres of land in the United States for every American. Ted Turner currently has the ability to fence off 2 MILLION of them and run around naked if he wishes. This is clearly ridiculous.

Because on the island we'd have the benefit of starting off from 0 ownership, every member would receive an equal amount of land along with the resources on it. There would be no blocking of rivers or any dirty tricks like this allowed, which would also necessarily stop any kind of concentrated agriculture or livestock operation from being set up. As new people are born, they will be allocated at the end of puberty a parcel of land made up of pieces of all the other citizen's land, and so as the population increases the land that each one owns will do the opposite and nobody will be immune from the terrible truth. Two people will survey the island each year and two people will check their equations to ensure that the land is equally divided and all of this will be done in full view of the public.

There will be no state secrets and to encourage this there will be no government infrastructure to speak of, except for maybe a single-room general purpose building that will never be locked and which everyone can beat their own path to, because there will be no road construction. 

Citizens will be encouraged to spy on one another but will also be encouraged to do whatever they please so long as they aren't doing anyone or any property physical harm, and so there really won't be anything to spy on. Talking openly and about any subject will be encouraged, because the act of talking never hurt anybody. 

There will be no line in the sand for age regulations.

To allow for society-changing projects, if adjoining people can agree to meld their properties, then the resources of separate properties can be used for completion of the projects. So, a project will never become too large that it encompasses more of society than wants it. If 7 adjacent people want to build a library, then they can do it on their land, but if adjoining neighbors do not want it, then no, you may not encroach on their property. 99 of you may agree to form some sort of Medicare, but I and my property do not have to participate if I don't want. 

For any crime-solving needs, the six most inquisitive islanders will be tasked with finding out exactly what transpired at the scene, and will inform everybody who will decide as a collective 100 what the punishment should be. Of course without any money then there won't be a reason to commit 99% of the crimes that we're used to taking place. 

The other 90 people without an assigned role can survive, and in that way serve the society. 

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#25) On November 18, 2009 at 5:15 AM, APJ4RealHoldings (33.31) wrote:

I'll slap down the big book on the table, and tell them this here is their new laws; The US Tax Code, I'll claim to be the only one who can interprit it & make up whatever I want in my interpretations & be immortal dictator! muahaha

 

No, really, just simply implement the US Constitution, Bill of Rights, separation of powers, Bunda voting count system (you get 1st choice, 2nd choice vote points), emphasis on:

-Separation of powers

-Not allowing formations of oligopolies / monopolies

-Let competition remain free

-Free market determined currency issuance

-Education on the reasons for debt avoidance, competition-killing avoidance, bunda voting system (you can actually vote for who you want to win & have a second choice), US constitution, Bill of Rights, separation of powers,; emphasize the history/stories of what happens with/without these things

 

So with the above, everyone and businesses are equal & have equal opportunities & level playing field...their actions will build value depending on how much the others demand for them...wanting their service/product.   Courts will uphold antitrust issues instead of ignoring them for big industry stalwarts.

 

 

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#26) On November 18, 2009 at 7:49 AM, DaretothREdux (39.76) wrote:

A lot of good thought-provoking comments here everyone. I will be working on my "government" throughout the rest of the day while I work, and hopefully will have it posted by the end of the day.

Stayed tune! For those of you just now tuning in, feel free to chime in on the discussion.

Dare

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#27) On November 18, 2009 at 12:06 PM, thongpatrol (< 20) wrote:

Dare,

 

make sure your government does not have any organized religions (for-profit) involved in any way. 

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#28) On November 18, 2009 at 4:14 PM, DaretothREdux (39.76) wrote:

My government is made up of 100 people who agree with the following document. I don't care what their professions are or what race or religion they are, as long as they would put there name to that document freedom would prevail.

Dare

P.S. If I'm not already on a "terrorist" watchlist...I probably am now.

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#29) On November 20, 2009 at 11:47 PM, HarryCarysGhost (99.70) wrote:

http://www.sff.net/people/adam-troy/random/theories.htm

Thats the Gilligan Link.

The Simpsons had an episode with this scenario. Homer was elected to run the power grid. Flanders was booted off because no one needs the leftorium. But the asteroid headed for springfield evaporated into the size of a chihauhaus head. Due to CO emmissions.

Casa ra sa ra.

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