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Valyooo (99.63)

Give me all of that worthless fiat

Recs

34

February 13, 2011 – Comments (32)

It amazes me how many people were too stubborn and missed the incredible bull market from September 1st to now.  Whether or not it was fake, inflated, stupid, a bubble, whatever...the markets up a lot, so don't get mad at the people who were a part of it.  If you don't want your 'funny money' then by all means, I will give you my address, please ship it to me.

32 Comments – Post Your Own

#1) On February 13, 2011 at 6:52 PM, russiangambit (29.49) wrote:

The way you frame the situation is wrong. There will come a day , I m certain of it, my be 5 or 10 years from now when financial  industry in the US will be back in its proper place, when it will stop being a parasite on the rest of the productive economy. When that day comes you better have skills that are useful in the productive economy. And I am not saying that you don't . I am just saying that there is entirely too much reward for speculation skills in the current economy.

Your post undescores what is wrong with the current state - we push people to develop skills in financial speculation at the expense of everything else. Skills that don't  dd anything to our economy  just skim the wlth off. We mock those who don't have these skills or have no interest/ inclination to develop them. We say it is their fault that they are being preyed upon by those who are more financially savvy.

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#2) On February 13, 2011 at 7:04 PM, Starfirenv (< 20) wrote:

+1 for  russiangambit

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#3) On February 13, 2011 at 7:30 PM, thecherryz (92.46) wrote:

Russian: 1 Valy: 0

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#4) On February 13, 2011 at 7:36 PM, ikkyu2 (99.38) wrote:

Yeah, really.  Put up or shut up, people.  If you don't want your fiat money, I'll take it too.  +1 Rec.

I have mad skills.  I can survive, get rich, and come to the top like cream, in any environment.  Period. 

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#5) On February 13, 2011 at 8:57 PM, 4thDensity (99.63) wrote:

I hear ya, Valyoo.  There are a lot of pissed off people who have cussed this rally all the way up and I suspect it's the people who use fundamentals and/or sentiment to analyze market direction.  The federal reserve has pretty much pissed on all that. 

As for the art of speculation, it is something that always has been and always will be.  It operates independently of a  production economy.  The fact that the US govt't/Federal Reserve has taken away the production factor shouldn't taint the speculation factor.  That's not our fault!  We play the game within the environment created by our "illustrious leaders" and people who have speculated their way to major profits in this environment shouldn't be scapegoated, because people from the old environment say the market "shouldn't" be behaving this way. 

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#6) On February 13, 2011 at 9:01 PM, checklist34 (99.73) wrote:

+1000 for Gambit, and rec for valy for title alone

Gambit, ...  that was said extremely well and it is EXTREMELY pertinent to our society and its long term success.  our best and brightest minds...  play around with stock trading.  

no inventing, no creating jobs, no new theories to expand the array of human knowledge, no newspaper empires, no oil empires that drive prices down 95% and make possible an industrial economy, no...

todays great fortunes are made by playing about in stock trading.  

its a titanic waste of resources.  But why wouldn't you just play around int he markets?  Why would you risk being sued (an inevitable event if you start an interesting business), face the legion of government agencies designed to make your life harder, face the challenges of finding quality employees, the frustration of being stolen from, and harsh competition and everything else...

when you could sit at home and push some buttons here and there.  

Its an epic waste of resources.  ...  but right now our society practically begs our best and brightest to do exactly that:  play about on their computers and trade stocks.

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#7) On February 13, 2011 at 9:39 PM, topsecret10 (22.02) wrote:

 I am one of the "stubborn" here.... forunately for me I was able to time 3 big moves down and back up just before the dow ran another 2000 points !  This type of market makes "pros" out of everyone and gives these "highly skilled" Individuals a false sense of net worth and security that will eventually be their downfall. I turned 40,000 Into 100,000 even though I was mostly on the sidelines for the last 1800 points on the Dow. I have been at this game a very long time,and the one thing that one must realize If they are going to STAY In this game Is that market sentiment can turn on a dime,and when It does,all of that monopoly money will still be In play,but this time It will be on the short side. Boom-Bust-Boom-Bust..... as long as the FED continues with It's failed policies of the past nothing Is going to change. This Is The first time In my lifetime that technical charting seems to fail a MAJORITY of the time. I hope all of my fellow fools will sit up and pay attention to everything that Is happening right now,and be prepared to change course when you least expect It.   Good Luck to all my fellow fools In their quest for solid Investment decisions....  :)    TS

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#8) On February 13, 2011 at 10:29 PM, checklist34 (99.73) wrote:

when I said "for title alone" I didn't mean the post wasn't cool, I get the joke...  believe me I get the joke...  hehe

Gambit's comment just struck a chord with me and I ranted, thats all

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#9) On February 13, 2011 at 10:36 PM, Momentum21 (96.33) wrote:

Firstly, all great plans work until they don't work...risk is ever-present...especially when reaping reward.

Both bulls and bears have had some extremely unique opportunities to make a lot of money in a short period of time.

Is the greed and speculation really any different from any other time of high volatility though? 

I kind of look at "speculators" or traders as playing on the fringes. Lots of those exchanges are zero sum games and the greedy are systematically killed off like victims of gang violence.

Of course no value is added once we have our basic needs met...but in the end these same traders wind up giving their money away to buy stuff that real people make. If the real people who make stuff were the only ones around we would have no one to buy iPads and Ford Expeditions.

Greed, fear, speculation, short selling, excessive consumption and financial engineering all play a role in the game we play. The question of whether each is right or wrong is profoundly important but probably not relevant for the purpose of the game itself.

I do think that deep inside people always know when they are adding value to society. Most careers we chose are a means to an end though. I certainly don't mock anyone without an interest in the stock market...I actually admire them.

I don't really know what point I am trying to make anymore...other than I agree with everyone here... : ) 

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#10) On February 13, 2011 at 11:13 PM, ChrisGraley (30.25) wrote:

You know you can keep whipping a horse and he'll keep running harder and harder.

You'll be winning the race and everything will be fine for a while. That horse will keep running till he drops dead.

Everything has a price. Same with free money.

Have you ever see what happens to a jockey when the horse goes down at full speed? 

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#11) On February 14, 2011 at 12:09 AM, HarryCarysGhost (99.76) wrote:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UBWeikxFgmI

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#12) On February 14, 2011 at 12:15 AM, Valyooo (99.63) wrote:

thecherryz,

Just because you're a bitter idiot about your fnma call, doesn't mean I am wrong. 

Russian, cherry, starfire....did I write anything in this blog about what skills would be needed in 5-10 years?  This is an investing site, not a "lets discuss what we can do to better ourselves and our useful skills in 10 years from now" site.  We are all here to talk about making money in the market.  If you missed a bull rally, then you missed a chance at more wealth....doesn't matter if YOU think the market should not have rallied, because it did, even without you.

Checklist, I do agree completely...but I think government policies make it this way.

Chris, I agree....but what is wrong with winning the race?

The point of this thread was not to say "If you missed this rally, you are an idiot" because it does not make you smart or dumb to partake in a rally.  My main point, what bothers me the most, is the people who actually call the people who DID ride the rally idiots for getting involved when its all a fake inflated bubble...if you missed it, there is nothing wrong with that at all....my point is, don't get mad at the people who did, that makes no sense.

I also don't think that people who make money in the stock market are somehow worthless for not producing...the markets are very important for big exciting corporations to get off the ground....traders DO add liquidity, whether or not you think this is total BS....there would be less underwritings if it were not for mutual funds and the like to buy them up

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#13) On February 14, 2011 at 12:25 AM, Valyooo (99.63) wrote:

Harry, did you hear where the guy says "Horse Jockeys are some of the toughest atheletes in the world"?

GTFO.  They're about as soft as....oh lets say Johnny Knox :)

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#14) On February 14, 2011 at 12:38 AM, ChrisGraley (30.25) wrote:

That depends on if you cross the finish line.

To those that got in and get out in time, I commend them.

To those people that see some type of signal coming and will get out of the market when they see that signal, I'll commend them too.

I don't see any signal coming to give me a clue on when to get out of the market, so I'll be fearful while others are being greedy. I still have a few horses in the race but I'm being light on the whip. I might not win the whole derby, but I should finish in the money and my horses should be able to race next week.

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#15) On February 14, 2011 at 12:46 AM, umps15 (56.23) wrote:

lol valyoo did you watch the whole video... imagine a 1000 - 2000lb animal trampling your face at 40 miles per hour.. This is comparative to the stock market, 

when the horse is winning you are doing fine.. but when it breaks its legs watch out.  

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#16) On February 14, 2011 at 1:25 AM, AvianFlu (34.92) wrote:

In my view we will soon be reaching a "musical chairs" moment. Retail investors who are inattentive may get blindsided. Stay alert.

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#17) On February 14, 2011 at 1:43 AM, ChrisGraley (30.25) wrote:

I should add that I do have a horse that has won a few triple crowns that I'm still riding.

They laughed at his pedigree when I entered him into the first race.

I hear that he's past his prime from others, but I think that he can still race. 

I'm pretty sure with this horse, that I'll know when to put him out to stud. 

Hi Ho Silver! 

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#18) On February 14, 2011 at 1:58 AM, Valyooo (99.63) wrote:

Chris, you are all about word play lately, haha.

I agree, you gotta get out when you can.  But this was specifically towards the "you idiots, you're only making fake money" people.

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#19) On February 14, 2011 at 2:03 AM, HarryCarysGhost (99.76) wrote:

Hey Chris,

Do you have a specific number?

I'm pretty sure with this horse, that I'll know when to put him out to stud. 

I was thinking that $50 should meet my needs.

We shall see.

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#20) On February 14, 2011 at 8:06 AM, ChrisGraley (30.25) wrote:

Right now I'm looking at $50 as well, but it really depends on how the dollar is looking.

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#21) On February 14, 2011 at 9:49 AM, ultrapaz (30.36) wrote:

How  could you not be invested in this bubble? 

 

WTG Valyhoo!!!! Congrats 

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#22) On February 14, 2011 at 10:04 AM, russiangambit (29.49) wrote:

> Russian, cherry, starfire....did I write anything in this blog about what skills would be needed in 5-10 years?  This is an investing site, not a "lets discuss what we can do to better ourselves and our useful skills in 10 years from now" site.  We are all here to talk about making money in the market.  If you missed a bull rally, then you missed a chance at more wealth....doesn't matter if YOU think the market should not have rallied, because it did, even without you.

Remember there was a time not so long ago when people actually worrried about "not losing money in the market". It is the other side. I don't think people stay away from the market because they think USDs are worthless. It is because they don't want to lose whatever they still have.

The last 2 months are pretty disturbing. It looks like everybody finally capitulated and everybody is in agreement that the market cannot god own whether they like it or not, whether they agreee with the current polcies or not.

As for my earlier comment, I just can't help myself, I always look at the big picture first. I need to know where I am going 5-10-205-0 years from now. If you don't you just get swept way by forces bigger than you are and you get lost in the minutae of life.

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#23) On February 14, 2011 at 12:43 PM, Valyooo (99.63) wrote:

You are missing my point.  My point is, how can you call somebody who participated in a bul market an idiot?  Money is money, whether or not you think it is "worthless inflated funny money" or not.

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#24) On February 14, 2011 at 1:31 PM, russiangambit (29.49) wrote:

> You are missing my point.  My point is, how can you call somebody who participated in a bul market an idiot?

Are you being ( what is the right word?) "facetious"? The answer to your literal question is  - because they are disagreeing with you and are rude. That is not what you wanted to know, I assume. You wanted to know why they are disagreeing with you. And I was trying to explain that while money is necessary as the medium of our economy , the money is not the ultimate goal in itself. Money is a representation of wealth, power and security, this is what most people seek and there are different ways to get there.

Let's take an example of last 6 months, the run of something like 20%. The stocks we are buying and selling are mostly already in existence, they are not new issues and therefore all the trasding activity over 6 months can be assumed to be close to zero sum gain and may be 5% of real wealth created by coporations during this time. So where the remaining 15% are coming from?  It is either losses by those who sold it to you or losses that will be born by those to whom you'll sell or by you once the market reverses to the mean. Another option is that the market flatlines and the actual wealth catches up with valuations. This second scenarios has a lost opportunity cost which is emotionally a little bit easier to bear.Anyway, there is a legitimate reason for people to be wary of buying stocks since there is high probability of them losing those 15% eventually. Yes, money is money, but if everybody engages is  zero sum games without creting actual wealth, eventually somebody has to bear the loss. You think it won't be you. As for me, I don't know. I am just glad I have a job outside of financial markets where I actually bring value to the real economy.

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#25) On February 14, 2011 at 2:29 PM, jesusfreakinco (29.12) wrote:

+1 for Russian

Valyooo - you are enabling a corrupt Fed that is destroying our country.  Momo traders that fuel the Fed are one step short of treasonous IMO.  The fact that making $ at any cost is being praised by some is a sad commentary on the US and one of the many reasons the US has seen its finest days.  What ever happened to doing what is right for the sake of principal?  Frankly your type disgusts me.  Sorry for the nastiness, but I have three kids and you are helping to destroy my country IMO.

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#26) On February 14, 2011 at 2:59 PM, Valyooo (99.63) wrote:

I am in no way a "momo" trader, nor am I requesting the fed fuels this fire anymore.  In fact, I have almost gotten kicked out of my economic classes for calling Keynes an idiot and saying the fed is corrupt.  I think what the Fed is doing is terrible.  However, here is the difference between you and I, Jesusfreakinco

Valyooo: "Fed, if you are going to sit here and destroy my purchasing power, I am going to stand up to you and invest in equities to keep my purchasing power.  I will not let you win".

Jesusfreakinco: "Fed, if you are going to sit here and destory my purchasing power, I am going to whine and cry about it and do nothing about it because I choose to make it a point to lose wealth.  I will let you win".

 

You are letting them win, I am not. I am investing in solid companies that are increasing earnings....oooo, what a bad guy I am!

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#27) On February 14, 2011 at 3:01 PM, Valyooo (99.63) wrote:

 Russia,

Look at the p/e of the SPY...is it really that overvalued?  It looks historically undervalued. If you think the market ruins the real economy why are you on  caps?

 You guys act like I am selling my children for money...I am a loyal generous person.  Instead of investing your money in companies that want to make the world a better place, you drive up the price of gold...seems counter intuitive.

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#28) On February 14, 2011 at 3:21 PM, russiangambit (29.49) wrote:

#27 -  don't think  this is something against you, you asked a valid question. My original rant #1 was inspired by some other "rip your face off" blogs on SA on the momo stocks juch as JDSU, LULU, CMG and so on. Your blog actually states the question very well. I loved the title. But the  people trading momo stocks know no fear.  It is amazing how fast people forget bad things when there is money to be made in forgetting. It is the  dot-com bubble all over. SPY overall is not expensive, but there is wide disparity in valuations. There are areas that are definitely bubbly. And purposely engeneered short squeezes are abound.

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#29) On February 14, 2011 at 3:25 PM, Valyooo (99.63) wrote:

Russian,

I have nothing against you at all, I enjoy what you have written.  But then you have people like "thecherry" who tries to make me look stupid, and jesusfreakinco who says I "disgust him", and it makes me think the only way to have people like you around here is to post things like "SIlver is good, fed is bad, I heart peter schiff".

It makes no sense to make blogs where there is no discussion...if you post a blog like that, everybody who already agrees with you recs it.  People who don't agree don't.  Nobody discusses or learns a thing.  

If you try to bring up a discussion, people jump down your throat...

Seems kinda like the US schooling system (this type of comment should bring in the rec's)

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#30) On February 14, 2011 at 3:27 PM, Valyooo (99.63) wrote:

For the record, my money is in 1) silver 2) gold 3) brazil 4) small cap etf's 5) natural gas 6) dsco 7) vnq 8) cni

I hold no momo names at all.

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#31) On February 14, 2011 at 3:39 PM, ikkyu2 (99.38) wrote:

You folks are having a nice little pitched battle here about Fed policy and what the Fed ought to be doing.

That will be very important at the next Fed Board of Governor's meeting; it'll be important that you clarify your opinions on Fed policy before you cast your votes.

What?  What's that you say? Neither of you sit on the Fed Board of Governors, nor are likely to in the future?

In that case, can it; shut your traps; put away your keyboards; and go make some money.  Flapping your jaws about this is a waste of your time. 

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#32) On February 14, 2011 at 3:52 PM, Valyooo (99.63) wrote:

Ikkyu,

....was I not saying exactly what you just said?  I am not disagreeing with anybody about what the fed should be doing...this has nothing to do with what the fed ought to be doing.  I know that what I think won't matter...that was the entire point of this blog.

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