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Please Cut the Crap...

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August 19, 2009 – Comments (11)

The Poop is not back, but I have a link to a guest post...

It seems the "Health care is great as it is" faction really believes no-one has read HR3200. Unfortunately for them that just isn't true.

An anti-HR3200 website has sent a list of "100 reasons to hate the Healthcare reform bill" twittering around Tweeterworld, with bulletpoints and reference page numbers.

Are their descriptions accurate...? Some examples and clarifications.

The whole list is linked above.

Page 203:  “The tax imposed under this section shall not be treated as tax.” Yes, it really says that.

 

No, actually, it doesn't. What is it about wingnuts that makes them think they can put a period anywhere they want, and change the meaning of something, and no one will notice? Here's what it REALLY says:

‘‘(4) NOT TREATED AS TAX IMPOSED BY THIS CHAPTER FOR CERTAIN PURPOSES.—The tax imposed under this section shall not be treated as tax imposed by this chapter for purposes of determining the amount of any credit under this chapter or for purposes of section 55.’’'

I can't explain what this means. I'm simply pointing out that it doesn't "really say" what they say it says...

Page 354:  Government will restrict enrollment of SPECIAL NEEDS individuals.

 

No. That's not what it says. What it says is, it will begin to phase such special needs individuals into the public health insurance system. IOW, those people who qualify for Medicaid and people under 65 who qualify for Medicare will be eligible for this system instead. Seriously, can wingnuts read at all?

 

11 Comments – Post Your Own

#1) On August 19, 2009 at 4:16 PM, jstegma (29.26) wrote:

I think I heard the special needs individuals would have to go before the death panels who will decide if paying for their care is efficient and practical or if they should just get end of life counseling.

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#2) On August 19, 2009 at 4:21 PM, devoish (98.36) wrote:

jstegma,

The more cost effective Conservative solution is to keep "end of life" counceling between you and your firing squad.

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#3) On August 19, 2009 at 4:36 PM, jstegma (29.26) wrote:

The bill itself is the one that needs end of life counseling.  It went before the American public and pleaded for mercy, but it was given the thumbs down.  The death panel was just doing its job.  :)

R.I.P. Obamacare.  It will be buried next to its predecessor Hillarycare.

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#4) On August 19, 2009 at 4:37 PM, whereaminow (20.75) wrote:

whoa, i was actually with you until that statement.

It clearly is a quote masqeurading as verbatim when it is not, but i would like to know what subsection 4 on page 203 means. So if anyone can tell me, that would be helpful.

I've heard about the death panels too, but figured that was just propaganda.  Any one have info on that?

David in Qatar

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#5) On August 19, 2009 at 4:52 PM, Varchild2008 (83.82) wrote:

"

‘‘(4) NOT TREATED AS TAX IMPOSED BY THIS CHAPTER FOR CERTAIN PURPOSES.—The tax imposed under this section shall not be treated as tax imposed by this chapter for purposes of determining the amount of any credit under this chapter or for purposes of section 55.’’'

I can't explain what this means. I'm simply pointing out that it doesn't "really say" what they say it says..."

Uhm.. No you're not.  It does say it.. Word for Word.... 

".—The tax imposed under this section shall not be treated as tax ...."

There it is.... It says it.... Word for Word.. Exactly says it...

Uhm.. I'm glad we killed Section 1233 "Death Panels" out of any consideration... But I am not glad that we are still sitting around debating about getting millions of Americans Health Care when the Federal Government is TRILLIONS of $$$$s in debt.

Clean up the Debt FIRST!   FIX THE ECONOMY FIRST!!!

Then maybe we can tackle Health Care Reform (Minus creating a Health Agency where a CZAR is given God Like Powers).

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#6) On August 19, 2009 at 5:05 PM, jstegma (29.26) wrote:

I think the Health Czar would be responsible for writing the White House guidelines that the death panels would follow in determining who should be referred for end of life counseling.  In a previous version of the bill there were to be payments to providers of euthanasia and assisted suicide, but those sections were removed for political reasons.

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#7) On August 19, 2009 at 5:13 PM, dudemonkey (38.38) wrote:

I heard that if someone forwarded your email to Obama's Snitching email address, you will be forced to get health care from Al Queda.

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#8) On August 19, 2009 at 5:29 PM, madcowmonkey (< 20) wrote:

The tax imposed under this section shall not be treated as tax imposed by this chapter for purposes of determining the amount of any credit under this chapter or for purposes of section 55.’’'

This still doesn't make any sense to anybody, so it is still pointless. In the end, people will be for something and others will be against it. Now if you could just figure out what line of BS is coming about with these types of statements that nobody can figure out, then by all means support how you like. There should be no ill will, but if you do not understand the reform bill, why in the heck would you be supporting it? Nobody can read that thing, therfore, nobody should be supporting it. Over a thousand pages.....really? It sounds like the government isnt trying to be limited with their powers on this. Enforcing later generations to pay higher taxes so people before them could live the life of "The Affordable American Dream" just doesn't sit well with me. 

Out of a thousand plus pages, I am sure there are more statements in that bill than the majority of the US citizens can't even comprehend. I just gave up on what you posted up there.....it sounds like you did too.

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#9) On August 19, 2009 at 5:37 PM, jstegma (29.26) wrote:

dudemonkey - I figured I'd just tell Obama's minions I was a Uigher if they came to round me up.  "Flush my Koran down the toilet and take me to a paradise island please!"

madcowmonkey - I think we can all agree that the bill is unintelligible, so let's keep the discussion on something we can all understand and get up in arms about like death panels.

Dr. Kevorkian supports Obamacare.

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#10) On August 19, 2009 at 5:48 PM, madcowmonkey (< 20) wrote:

jstegma- they pull chords all the time....except it is a doctor telling you instead of government...... I think anyway.

Go ahead an initiate the death panel. From my understanding it is if you are on your death bed and it is reviewed every five years. If I am on my death bed for more than 1 month and I have said my peace to family. Take me out, please. Shoot me, drug me up, and throw me off a 30 story building. Wait, drug me up first, then shoot me, and then throw. 5 years to review? Was that suppose to be politically correct to wait that long. 

Personally, I don't care if it is in there or not. I don't support government bills that put the next generation(s) deeper in debt. End of story. 

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#11) On August 19, 2009 at 6:08 PM, Mary953 (76.72) wrote:

I haven't read this bill.  I used to read a fair amount of Government-speak type stuff (letters, memos, forms, legislation, regulation, etc)

This may be what it means if the tax is not treated as a tax. 

Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid are not treated as a tax.  You pay based on income, but there is nothing that marks your money as yours.  That means if you want something - an elective medical treatment or all of the money you put into your "retirement fund,"  that's is just too bad.  It isn't a tax but an entitlement - and you ain't entitled to it just cause you worked to earn it.  I am paying insurance to take care of the most extreme concerns.  I do not mind helping out members of my family.  I do not want to add the burden of Every person in Every city or county in Every State or Territory.  That may be cold and cruel to consider but at some point , I want to bail out me.  As for my own very critical illness some day, let me choose whether I want treatment.  At some point, I anticipate choosing to refuse it. (but not for quite a while yet)

And again, I haven't read the bill. Maybe I'm not old enough!  http://bighollywood.breitbart.com/ggutfeld/2009/08/17/daily-gut-thank-you-old-people/

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