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"100% chance of a recession in the next year"

Recs

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December 27, 2007 – Comments (8)

Anyone buying real estate and stocks might want to google recession before they make that purchase. Taken from www.garynorth.com:

John Mauldin recently quoted David Rosenberg, chief economist for North America for Merrill "We're bullish on America" Lynch.

We recently unveiled a new recession probability indicator that uses the shape of the yield curve (10-year note/3-month LIBOR) and corporate spreads (Baa) to predict the probability of a recession within the next 12 months. (The model is based on a recent Fed paper, which used the 10/2-year yield curve and Aa spreads.) The results are striking: taking into account corporate spreads, the model is flashing a 100% chance of a recession in the next year, up from 75% in October and essentially zero in the summer. Looking at history, the model did a pretty good job predicting the 1990-91 and 2001 recessions. In December 1989, recession odds jumped to 95%, and by August 1990 an official recession had set in. Similarly, the model was showing 100% recession odds in October 2000; by September 2001, the economy was in an official downturn.http://www.frontlinethoughts.com/pdf/mwo122107.pdf 

Even more graphic are his words, quoted by the London Telegraph (Dec. 5).

Merrill Lynch's North America economist David Rosenberg presented an almost unremittingly gloomy forecast for the US economy next year. "The US consumer is on the precipice of experiencing its first recessionary phase since 1991 - the last time we had the combination of high, punishing energy prices; weakening employment conditions; real estate deflation and tightening credit conditions" he said.

The only ray of light is in America's export sector, which Mr Rosenberg said was "literally booming" as a result of the plunging dollar and still strong growth in the rest of the world. Merrill said investors should play the ongoing shift in economic power in the world by investing in US exporters and companies serving the fast-expanding domestic economies of emerging markets.

Mr Rosenberg said high energy prices alone would drain 1.5 percentage points from American economic growth and he warned that gasoline prices of more than $3 a gallon were the equivalent of a 1pc wage cut across the US economy, "just in time for the holiday season".

He said growth in employment had halved compared with a year ago and warned that only three sectors - the government, health and leisure - were still creating jobs. The rest of the economy, accounting for 60pc of all employment, had shed 50,000 jobs in the past two months.

On the housing market, Merrill warned that the supply of unsold new homes had doubled compared with the recent boom years, while sales of second-hand homes had fallen by 30pc.

"We reiterate that real estate deflations are unique and have never ended well for the consumer, the credit market or the economy. We can identify only five periods post WWII when the real value of housing assets turned negative on a year-on-year basis. All of these time periods inevitably included a consumer downturn. Maybe it will be different this time, but we fail to see why," Mr Rosenberg concluded.

8 Comments – Post Your Own

#1) On December 27, 2007 at 3:10 AM, raytoei (96.71) wrote:

hey..100% means that there isn't much scope for wiggle room is there ? I mean, the rear view mirror is a good indicator, but words like "always", "never", "forever" and "100%" are quite dangerous when used to refer to financial events.

raytoei 

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#2) On December 27, 2007 at 11:03 AM, dwot (99.55) wrote:

I have to agree, and this time it will be worse.  Never have so many been in debt for so much and at low interest rates.  Maxed out on debt at low interest rates is much harder to recover from then being maxed out at high interest rates.

 I have no idea where I found this, but it is an affordability index for housing going back to 1980.

http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=pHy7hQjBLOcrdiwrFOl0DEg&hl=en# 

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#3) On December 27, 2007 at 7:30 PM, tmer11 (< 20) wrote:

I am long and you do not scare me!

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#4) On December 27, 2007 at 10:08 PM, Harold71 (28.93) wrote:

I've come for my daily dose of pessimism...err, reality?

Seriously though, dwot, I realize you are quite astute, but "Maxed out on debt at low interest rates is much harder to recover from then being maxed out at high interest rates," seems to defy logic. 

Can you explain this statement?

 Thanks!

Harold

(Oh yeah, FWIW, I too see a tapped out, consumer-led recession on the way.)

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#5) On December 28, 2007 at 3:12 AM, StockSpreadsheet (74.49) wrote:

Harold,

I can answer that one for dwot, I believe.  If your debt is at a high interest rate, you can hope to refinance to a lower interest rate.  That could save you hundreds a month on your mortgage payment, making your bills easier to handle.  If all of your debt is at low interest rates, then the rates going lower doesn't save you as much money, as they don't have much farther to fall.   If your mortgage was financed at 9% and interest rates fell to 5%, that would make a huge difference in your monthly mortgage payment.  If your mortgage is already at 5%, then rates probably won't fall much further, so you don't have the chance to refinance to lower your monthly mortgage payment.  This can be very difficult if you maxed yourself out to afford the place in the first place and interest rates start climbing on you and your adjustable-rate mortgage, (or your income falls and you want to refinance at a lower rate to bring your bills more inline with your income).  

Don't want to put words in dwot's mouth, so I can't say I speak for her, but I'm pretty sure that is what she was referring to.

Craig 

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#6) On December 29, 2007 at 6:01 PM, abitare (99.44) wrote:

ALCON,

Thanks for the replies. I have to say, the more I hear MER and others talk about recession and housing crash etc... the more I begin to believe it may be over / ending? Whenever, these guys crowd one side of the boat the more I want to move on the other side of the boat.

If MER is so smart why did they just write off billions, fire their CEO Stan O'Neal and pay him $161 million to "retire"? Now they are predicting a "future" recession? The housing, retail, finanials, banking, lending and automobile stocks have sold off. Now they are predicting a "recession"? Where were they six months ago?

If MER wants to be smart pay me HALF of what they paid Stan O'Neal to quit and I will promise to work for them and not quit for 60 months?  I HAD 3644 POINTS in five months! How many points could Stan O'Neal get?

Who is Merrill's champion?

MERRILL LYNCH BRING FORTH YOUR CHAMPION!

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#7) On January 03, 2008 at 4:33 PM, phb59 (< 20) wrote:

From a psychological point of view I can see why being able to reduce your interest rate on debt would be good but practically I still don't understand how debt at a high interest rate is better than debt at a low interest rate.

I agree that if you can reduce your interest rate the better off you'll feel initially. However, in the long run I would much rather be maxed out in debt with as low an interest rate as possible because after reducing your interest rate you still have the debt to pay off albeit in smaller amounts. 

 Assuming all things being equal, If person A is maxed out at $10,000 in debt with a 10% interest rate and person B is maxed out at $10,000 in debt with a 5% interest rate then person B is better off with more available cash than A. Now if person A can reduce his/her interest rate by 5% he/she is better off than before with more available cash but no better off than person A. 

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#8) On January 14, 2008 at 11:41 PM, dwot (99.55) wrote:

That is part of it Craig.  You are also much more at risk of seeing higher rates.  And you far less empowered to get ahead by increasing debt payments.  A modest increase in payments when the debt was at high rates means you pay it back so much faster.

My Six Degrees of Leverage series in December looks at the differences in debt.

 

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