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L0RDZ (84.26)

So Obama wants to use the LIAR card everything you said is a lie is a common retort from him

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October 23, 2012 – Comments (14)

http://news.yahoo.com/obama-inflated-jobs-claim-184609682--politics.html

Well according  to  his own  gov-ment  labor  statistics  per  said  article:

According to the most recent employment figures from the Bureau of Labor Statistics, the economy has eked out a net gain of 325,000 jobs since January 2009, when Obama took office. And that’s giving credit for roughly 386,000 jobs that the BLS has announced, on a preliminary basis, that it will be adding to this year’s employment totals next year, as a result of its routine annual “benchmarking” analysis.

So  how  can  Obama  with a straight  face  talk about  how  we  are  on  the  right direction ? 

I'd  love  to see  Romney  put together a  commercial  with  3  old women asking wheres  the beef  in  his  job  creation claims ???

Anyone remember  the old Wendy's  commercial where  those old ladies  look inside the buns and one asks,  " Wheres  the beef ?"  

Also  FYI   it  doesn't  count all the public sector  jobs  lost  despite  all the money we plugged into propping up local gov-ments.

Perhaps  a  community organizer  with little real world  job  and business experience  was  a  poor choice,   we  are  on  the road  to no where but we are headed in the right direction right ?

Yes he can ?   redistribute  to those who can't.

To all  the fools  who respond by saying Romney is no different,   I  say  can his ideas really make things  worst,  his plan  at  the very least  is still more  thoughtful and based upon a real business persons  real world  perspective  not  someone who was lucky enough to be at  the right place in the right time who happened to  be  fortunate  enough  to  only  win  53%  of  the vote  with all the wind to his back  in  the 2008  election  vs  John Mccain.

14 Comments – Post Your Own

#1) On October 23, 2012 at 9:07 PM, blake303 (29.54) wrote:

I consider this the right direction.  

http://finance.yahoo.com/echarts?s=%5EDJI+Interactive#symbol=%5Edji;range=20090121,20121022;compare=;indicator=volume;charttype=area;crosshair=on;ohlcvalues=0;logscale=off;source=undefined;

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#2) On October 23, 2012 at 10:35 PM, HuellHowser (< 20) wrote:

So you're saying politicians lie? 

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#3) On October 24, 2012 at 10:14 AM, edwjm (99.87) wrote:

All Politicans lie!!!

It's part of the job description.

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#4) On October 24, 2012 at 4:09 PM, awallejr (82.72) wrote:

To all  the fools  who respond by saying Romney is no different,   I  say  can his ideas really make things  worst,  his plan  at  the very least  is still more  thoughtful

Thoughtful?  He gives no details.  He says 5 power points and we are left to fill in the blanks.  It is magic wand economics.  Poof!  He created 12 million jobs.

Of course he wont be able to do better and could possibly make things worse.  The reason?  We are still in a massive deleveraging period that will continue for years.  And that isn't conducive for strong growth.  Yet Romney wants to cut the legs out of the "healing" process that Bernanke has been trying to create.  The real estate market is continuing to improve (great numbers today) and Romney wants to cut the legs out of it by reducing the tax breaks that are designed to encourage home ownership.

Oh and Romney's BIG lie.  He will repeal Obamacare on day one.  Romney may want to actually read the Constitution because only Congress can.  A "minor" point he doesn't mention.

And I don't ever want to see Ryan a heartbeat away from the Presidency.  So yes things can get worse. And if the Republican Norquistites stopped the nonsense and worked for the Country and not an individual perhaps things could improve even more.

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#5) On October 24, 2012 at 8:38 PM, L0RDZ (84.26) wrote:

ttp://player.ooyala.com/player.js?video_pcode=9kcm06PtVGNZkFkXR2898mHnBha_&height=303&embedCode=loZnZnNToK2y4gvMA8__ZXlF61kbeBcV&width=540&deepLinkEmbedCode=loZnZnNToK2y4gvMA8__ZXlF61kbeBcV">

 According to Kudlow  should Obama win re-election  his plan  for the next four  years  is  to do the same he's done in  his first four years  but  less.

 

 

 

 

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#6) On October 24, 2012 at 9:47 PM, Valyooo (99.63) wrote:

@awallejr,

 

We are deleveraging?  How so?  The US has more debt than ever.  The unemployment rate is high and interest rates are low and a lot of people are going back to school and taking out more student loans than ever.

 

So to recap: 1) Highest amount of national debt ever  2) Highest amount of student loan debt ever 3) Extremely high level of people not earning wages that have to borrow in the form of credit card debt

 

How are we deleveraging? 

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#7) On October 25, 2012 at 1:38 AM, awallejr (82.72) wrote:

How are we deleveraging?

I am talking about households.  And last few years the average household has reduced debt by 10%.  And this has to continue. So there is no wiggle room for strong growth.  Not as long as households need to keep deleveraging.

And what is Bernanke doing with QE3?  He is buying MBSs.  Which is him creating a market for the banks to lend and sell.  It is a brilliant plan.  One many just don't see.  It is not inflationary since those mortgages get paid back TO the fed and in time they can retire the cash as those MBSs get paid off.

He is helping people deleverage and he is helping banks to recapitalize.  Things needed to be done because of the LUNACY of the housing bubble.

And enter Romney who doesn't give a rat's ass and will undo all these efforts only to throw us back into recession.

And Bizarro Alstry as for Kudlow I lost respect for him the day he decided to change his show to being a Republican political tout.  I used to like his format where he would have like 3-5 guests discussing the stock market.  Now it is he and 1 or 2 Republicans ganging up on a paid liberal correspondent.

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#8) On October 29, 2012 at 1:23 PM, JaysRage (90.49) wrote:

Taking private debt and making it public is not deleveraging.  

You're just moving the money around.   I'm sure that anyone in the real estate industry is thrilled that the Fed is buying mortgage-backed securities.   It's another real estate bailout.   The Fed takes on all of these risky assets, allowing the banks to continue their same old strategy of enjoying all of the profits of risky behavior and none of the downside, re-inflating the housing bubble.   Just great.   It's just setting the table for the next fall.   You can't keep re-inflating bubbles without eventually having to pay the piper.   

If it's not inflationary and no belt-tightening has happened, it hasn't solved anything.   

On top of that, here's an excerpt from a site that has correctly deduced what is actually happening in terms of private debt.   Not nearly the happy-feel-good story you're trying to relate.  

 

Why did indebtedness fall in 2009 and 2012? Ideally, debt levels would have fallen because newly frugal Americans paid off their credit card balances. However, a number of not-so-pleasant factors contributed to the decline. In 2010, credit card companies wrote off seriously delinquent debts in earnest, lowering the total amount of revolving credit card debt. The charge-off rate – the percentage of dollars owed that issuers have written off as uncollectable – rose to 10.9% in the second quarter of 2010. This represented an increase of over 300% from the first quarter of 2006, when the charge-off rate was only 3.1%. Charge-offs account for a significant portion of the debt reduction.

The graph says it all: between the fourth quarter of 2009 and the fourth quarter of 2010, average household debt fell by $2,722. The speed with which average debt fell indicates that loans were written off, rather than paid off. As a result of those losses, spooked credit card companies tightened their purse strings. Stricter lending standards also contributed to a fall in total credit card debt. Those two factors – fewer loans, made to more creditworthy consumers – are troubling, as they speak to a one-off correction rather than an improvement in underlying factors such as increased income or fiscal prudence.

 

http://www.nerdwallet.com/blog/credit-card-data/average-credit-card-debt-household/ 

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#9) On October 29, 2012 at 5:53 PM, awallejr (82.72) wrote:

Debt reduction from banks writing off credit cards and mortgages  has always  happened.  And during a major financial collpase I doubt anyone would dispute a considerable increase of this occuring.  Your link, however, merely makes conclusions off general charts.  They do, however, state this:

Two things stand out: overall credit card debt is down, and the average indebted household is less underwater relative to the average overall than before.

I know people that actually made concerted efforts to bring down their household debt without outright defaulting.  I know I have.  And that's the point.  It is still happening and will continue to happen for years.  So with this drag there simply isn't any specific "non magical wand" strong growth catalyst proposed by ANYONE.  Not by Romney.  Not by Obama.  Because there isn't one.

It is simply a question of whose policies will do the most damage over the next four years.  I think it would be Romney's for the reasons I blogged all over.  You are free to think it Obama, except under Obama at least things have been improving.  Unknown for Romney.

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#10) On October 30, 2012 at 2:16 AM, awallejr (82.72) wrote:

This is what really annoys me, the fact that certain people don't want to acknowledge that this country was facing financial armageddon back in 2008.  Kudlow is a pathetic example.  He shouts why aren't we expanding at 6% GDP.  Why only 2%. We didn't do that under Reagan.

Except the demographics are completely different (boomers were in their prime under Reagan but not now) and we are recovering from one of THE GREATEST financial crashes in history.  Let me repeat because people seem to want to forget this, we are recovering from one of THE GREATEST financial crisis in history. 

You don't get 6% GDP recoveries from that. You get NEGATIVE 6% GDP. So at 2% growth that is GREAT given the circumstances.  Stop ignoring that circumstance, which the Kudlowites are trying to do.

 

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#11) On October 30, 2012 at 2:29 PM, JaysRage (90.49) wrote:

I understand what we were facing in 2008.    The difference in opinion is that you have an opinion that we are actually recovering, rather than resetting the table for another crash.   Reinflating the bubble and making private debt public make some of the numbers look better, but real private sector growth is not happening.   On top of that, earnings have begun to falter.

GDP takes into account government spending, which is currently at a trillion dollar deficit annually.  

Current calculations have private sector growth as negative.   That's not a recovery.  

Anyone that understands the statistical metric of "average" can comprehend that you can move an average in many different ways.   One way is that all of the components move.   Another is that a small percentage of the components move a lot.   The graphs and the bank data (300% increase in write-offs) better supports the theory that bad debt write-offs moved a small percentage of the components a lot and most people didn't move at all.    

The flat line at the end of the graph says it all.  

Household debt is staying constant now that the bad debt has been written off.  I think the conclusions are spot on.  Things aren't getting better.  

Just because you know some people who have managed their money better doesn't mean that the masses have changed their behavior at all.    The data shows that they haven't changed.   You can pretend that things have changed, but that doesn't make it real. 

One thing I'll agree on is that it is a difficult task facing the next President, relative to the economy.   What we DO NOT agree on is that Obama has done a good job.    

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#12) On October 30, 2012 at 5:27 PM, awallejr (82.72) wrote:

The charge-off rate – the percentage of dollars owed that issuers have written off as uncollectable – rose to 10.9% in the second quarter of 2010. This represented an increase of over 300% from the first quarter of 2006, when the charge-off rate was only 3.1%. Charge-offs account for a significant portion of the debt reduction.

That is it.  That's the proof your link gave. ONE statistic.  Your link is conclusory.  They even admitt that they lack reliable data here: In March 2010, the last date at which the data can be reliably estimated.  So their charts and numbers after March 2010 are simply things they estimated.

But you keep believing that responsible Americans haven't been trying to retool their budgets and that is all a bunch of deadbeats writing debt off.

That still skirts the point of my argument, that there is no tremendous catalyst that will turn things around in a matter of years.  You don't remember the crash because if you did you would think it amazing we didn't go into a deep depression.

I never said Obama did a good job.  I gave you links in one of your threads where I criticized him several times.  What I don't like, however, is being given a con job by Romney, Kudlow and the Republican Norquistites. 

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#13) On October 30, 2012 at 6:23 PM, L0RDZ (84.26) wrote:

If I  can  steal  a line from POTUS...

Everything A wall E  JR  said  is  untrue...  you   are a liar...  now  for me to use a few lines  from  pirates of the Carribean...

[slow motion scene of falling dice]

               [three crewman are playing Liar's Dice]

               [organ music is heard in the background]

                                     MACCUS
                         I wager... ten years.

                                     ?KOLENIKO
                         I'll match ten years.

                                     GREENBEARD
                         Agreed.

                                     WILL TURNER
                         I understand.

                                    
                         Liar!)

                                     WILL TURNER
                         It's a game of deception. Your bet includes
                         all the dice, not just your own.

                                     WILL TURNER
                         What are they wagering?

                                     WILL TURNER
                         So any crewman can be challenged?

                                     WILL TURNER
                          I challenge Davy Jones.

               [immediately the organ music ceases, immediately Jones' peg leg
               is heard thumping in approach]

               [with each thump of his footstep, gooseneck barnacles retract]

              
               [someone laughs]

                                     DAVY JONES
                         I accept ?that-uh.

               [Jones sits down at the gambling table]

                                     DAVY JONES
                         The stakes?

                                     WILL TURNER
                         My soul. An eternity of servitude.

                        
                                     DAVY JONES
                         Against?

                                     WILL TURNER
                         I want this.

               [Jack shows Jones the picture of the key]

                                     DAVY JONES
                         How do you know of the key?

                                     WILL TURNER
                         That's not part of the game, is it?
                         You can still walk away.

               [One of Jones' tentacles pulls out the key from his vest to display
               it]

               [the tentacle puts the key back]

               [Bootstrap sits down at the table]

                                     DAVY JONES
                         What's this?

                                     WILL TURNER
                         No! Don't do this.

                                     DAVY JONES
                         Four fours.

                                     WILL TURNER
                         Four fives.

                                     DAVY JONES
                          Seven fives-uh.

                                     WILL TURNER
                          Eight fives.

                                     DAVY JONES
                         Huh huh huh. Welcome to the crew, liar.
                        

                                     DAVY JONES
                         And be called a liar myself for my trouble?
                         Bootstrap Bill, you're a liar and you
                         will spend an eternity on this ship!
                         Master Turner, feel free to go ashore...
                          the very next time we make port!  
                        

                                     WILL TURNER
                         Fool. Why did you do that?

                                     WILL TURNER
                         It was never about winning, or losing.

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#14) On October 30, 2012 at 8:09 PM, awallejr (82.72) wrote:

Well being untrue and being a liar are not the same things.  But with that aside I have always put my cards on the table here. You are free to believe or not. 

But November 6 IS about winning or losing. The Haves will continue to win and the Have Nots will continue to lose.  It will not change until you slap term limits on Congress and get rid of the career politicians.

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