lemoneater (88.51)

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#1) On December 14, 2010 at 5:04 PM, lemoneater (88.51) wrote:

The only time illogical business hours make sense is if one doesn't want customers to come.

If you serve breakfast, don't wait until 8:30 on weekdays to open. The same goes for a doughnut shop: late morning hours don't make sense. Also if your hours are different every single week day with no discernable pattern, your potential customers might never even come. One doesn't wish to consult a farmer's almanac to decide if a store might be open.

I will add more later:)

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#2) On December 14, 2010 at 11:20 PM, rd80 (99.10) wrote:

6.  Marketing with spam.

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#3) On December 15, 2010 at 7:58 AM, lemoneater (88.51) wrote:

You're right, rd80. Last night I thought of a way to express how I feel about the spamercials. Here it goes.

Like a Greek chorus they follow after me

with ni-hil-ist-ic syntax,

and ex-ist-en-tial-ist-ic cries:

"Buy, buy, buy,

Handbags, and shoes, and ties!"

 

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#4) On December 15, 2010 at 8:52 AM, lemoneater (88.51) wrote:

I just dedicated that poem to poor Option1307 who has been spamplagued also.

P.S. Thanks for removing the spamercials.

Now where was I? Invisible store location. I've seen this particular phenomenon work itself out multiple times in the same location near my home. There appears to be a retail no man's land not too far away which is off of the main highway filled with prosperous businesses.  

Although lawyers and dentists are are tucked out of view on a side street they still seem to get enough business, but the same is not true for a retail building we call The Building. Once upon a time it was a home decorating shop, once upon another time it was a drug store, and memory fails me as to the other retail businesses I've seen there. Last I looked the building was empty. It is a nice spacious building with a good parking lot but for some reason retail doesn't thrive there.

Perhaps signage on the main highway would help to direct the potential customer or perhaps the building should be made into a studio for a gifted solitude craving artist.

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#5) On December 15, 2010 at 9:57 AM, lemoneater (88.51) wrote:

I hardly need to explain phenomenally rude customer service. Probably most of us have experienced it at some time or the other. (I have off days where I need to be really carefully I don't give phenomenally bad service. But I think some employees are past caring about less than lovely sales transactions.)

However one tale comes to mind, The Saga of the Crabby Icecream Shop. Late one evening three college students craved some special icecream so they said let's go to the nearby icecream shop and buy some. Simple, right? Well, not exactly.

We got to the shop and I was surprised to notice that we were the only ones in the restaurant. It wasn't a weekend, but in a college town every day should bring some hungry customers in need of a treat. Especially since at the time there were fewer icecream stores and at wider intervals.

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#6) On December 15, 2010 at 10:04 AM, lemoneater (88.51) wrote:

We waited for a while before a waitress came. When she came she was very grumpy-- which was somewhat a mystery to me since I couldn't see that she was walked off her feet with no other customers--in sight. None of us had been there before so we were not certain exactly what to order. She gave no suggestions, but huffily left when we were still looking at the pricey choices about $4 each about 14 years ago. I wasn't paying but still I had no desire to gouge the wallet of my friend's brother.

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#7) On December 15, 2010 at 10:25 AM, lemoneater (88.51) wrote:

I looked at my friend and her brother and said. "This isn't any fun. Let's leave." So we went to a fast food place nearby and got some soft serve.  

A while later some months or even a year, I was dating my future husband and he suggested that we go to the nearest icecream shop. It had been a long enough time from the last time that I thought perhaps the experience would be different. I was wrong. The restaurant was mostly bare, not always a bad thing for a romantic setting but a little worrisome. A maiden came out and grimly took our order with a very ill grace. In spite of its price the icecream was not special and we both said "never again."

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#8) On December 15, 2010 at 10:30 AM, lemoneater (88.51) wrote:

There is a happy ending to this story from the customer's point of view. A short while later the shop closed. After a few metamorphoses the shop magically transformed into a Greek restaurant with friendly service, delicious gyros, and affordable pricing.

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#9) On December 15, 2010 at 10:40 AM, lemoneater (88.51) wrote:

For an example of a bewilderingly new product, I will use an example from my teen years that I have alluded to before. When I lived in West Virginia, someone who recently moved there from Louisana had the idea of bringing fresh shrimp by truck to sell in my neighborhood. The market was wide open our grocery stores had no such seafood--not much seafood at all as I recall.

They had invested most of their free cash in the venture that month which is why I ended up getting two pounds of shrimp as a babysitting fee. Shrimp scampi is delicious. Also the lady fixed a dish with hot pepper sauce--quite fantastic.  

 

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#10) On December 15, 2010 at 10:53 AM, lemoneater (88.51) wrote:

However, except for my family (I think one of my brothers bought some) they had practically no customers.

The moral is clear. Do market research to find out market demand. Don't assume wonderful products will automatically guarantee sales. Create demand and educate potential customers before you commit substantial funds.

Thanks to my brother for his analysis so many years ago of what went wrong.

P.S. I learned how to prepare shrimp from that experience and years later I prepared some for a college student from Louisiana needing a taste of home. 

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#11) On December 15, 2010 at 11:11 AM, lemoneater (88.51) wrote:

For unsustainably low prices, I have yet another seafood example. When I visited my oldest brother in law school, he took me to an all you could eat meat/seafood buffet. I think the price was $4.99. We piled our plates high--mostly chicken and beef for me since I have a taste for seafood I prepare myself. (Alas, those happy days are gone when three or even four servings did nothing to my weight). I asked how can they afford to serve so much for such a good price? He said they can't. That was a paradoxical concept to me that if the price is wrong too many customers can drive one right out of business.

Since that time my husband has pointed out the same phenomenon numerous times to me. A few loss leaders might be acceptable to attract customers and accustom them to your quality and service, but when all your products are loss leaders sales success equals failure.

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#12) On December 15, 2010 at 11:32 AM, ETFsRule (99.90) wrote:

Great post.

I think these rules apply the best to discretionary things, like the ice cream or a retail store.

For doctors, many of the rules don't apply. Location is a good example, but also rudeness - many people will put up with a rude doctor because their service is so important.

Also, it seems that many banks get away with having ridiculous hours of business - although I'm not sure why this is the case.

And, I want to mention that online businesses operate in a whole different world. Their set of rules would look very different (customer service is less important for them, but low prices are very important).

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#13) On December 15, 2010 at 11:37 AM, outoffocus (24.53) wrote:

I would say growing too fast.  People tend to despise small beginnings so they grow too fast and get themselves into too much debt, which is a fast track to bankruptcy court.

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#14) On December 15, 2010 at 1:45 PM, lemoneater (88.51) wrote:

@ #4 I wanted to add that The Building, the failed retail location also was a furniture store at one time. I think at least five different businesses have tried to make a go of it there. That is a lot of turnover for about five years time since when I moved nearby.

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#15) On December 15, 2010 at 1:53 PM, Pick1es (23.35) wrote:

the ice cream place's failure was probably due to poor management. the part time worker would rather have freetime at the expense of the business since the job is most likely short term/hourly and there is no incentive for treating the customers well, just the disincentive of having to deal with more customers.

When I was in high school, I tried to work for businesses that were going out of business so I could just sit around and do homework instead of work.

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#16) On December 15, 2010 at 2:18 PM, lemoneater (88.51) wrote:

@ #13 Thanks very much for your feedback, ETFsRule. 

To a certain extent restaurants and other retail shops fit more into the category of discretionary, while doctors fit more into the category of necessity. 

I have more choice of doctors than most here because the hospital system in Greenville county is one of the largest employers and so we have a flourishing medical community. Even so there is less choice in specialists because of referral matters. I think specialist are special partly because there are less of them. Unfortunately some of them leave much to be desired in their bedside manner.

If you can solve the mystery of why some banks have such strange hours, you will have solved one of the mysteries of the universe.

Yes, e-commerce is a new retail world. Customer visibility is still crucial, but that is more a matter of clicks than bricks or so I've heard. 

I think customer service only will increase in importance in judging internet companies in the future as customer expectations get higher with more experience. I always read what other customers say about a product on Amazon for instance.

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#17) On December 15, 2010 at 2:55 PM, lemoneater (88.51) wrote:

@ #16 That is an interesting insight, fearandbullets. I would think customers would occasionally provide a welcome break from studies:). I think poor management was right!  

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#18) On December 15, 2010 at 3:16 PM, lemoneater (88.51) wrote:

@ #14 Carrying too much debt seems to be a chronic business problem which tempts small businesses. (Even big businesses which should know better often carry too much debt. Can I say the Federal Government.) Good observation, outoffocus. I just wish I had thought to add it to my original list.

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#19) On December 15, 2010 at 5:06 PM, PhulishMortal (< 20) wrote:

   The question of banks' hours is one that has puzzled me for many years, since my first full-time job after graduating college.  

   I was working at Platt Saco-Lowell -- a business in Easley, a town about half an hour away from my home.  (Fun fact: Platt Saco-Lowell at that time was owned by John D. Hollingworth's business "Hollingsworth on Wheels." This name was, naturally, abbreviated to "Holl-on-wheels" in our computer programs.)  Anyway, Easley being a fairly small town,our plant was one of the largest customers of the local banks; nevertheless, come payday, all the banks closed up shop at lunch hour every day, payday or no, making themselves unavailable for a tremendous influx of their customers.  I never understood that.

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#20) On December 15, 2010 at 5:11 PM, PhulishMortal (< 20) wrote:

    I also have a "rude business" story.  There used to be a restaurant named "South City Grill" (or possibly "Grille") near my office in Greenville. All of us in my lunch group were big fans of SCG, even though the prices there were higher than most other places around; the food was very good and the menu a bit different from most places.

    We were all regular customers at lunch for a good while, but at some point the service went severely downhill, in competence and especially in attitude.  We quit going after they were exceptionally rude to one of our friends.  The place closed up shop within about six months thereafter.

   I wonder, though, whether the place may have already been having some financial trouble and the rudeness was as much a symptom of stress as a reason for it. I can't imagine it would be easy having a place you have put so much work into going through hard times.

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#21) On December 16, 2010 at 7:58 AM, lemoneater (88.51) wrote:

@ #19 Sometimes I think that if your bank is part of a franchise(if that word can be applied to a group of banks) it goes with the hours chosen for all the locations regardless of logic or customer's needs--just one instance where central planning is a losing strategy.

 

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#22) On December 16, 2010 at 8:27 AM, lemoneater (88.51) wrote:

@ #20 I never ate at that particular restaurant, but I remember when they had billboards at strategic locations advertising their delicious looking steaks. There are so many restaurants here that the market must be highly competitive. I think restaurants are low profit margin businesses under the best of circumstances.

Perhaps rude customer service is more a symptom of a failing business than a primary cause of failure, Phulish. How does one raise morale when a business is having hard time so that bad doesn't become worse? 

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#23) On December 16, 2010 at 8:36 AM, lemoneater (88.51) wrote:

@ #18 outoffocus, are there any helpful rules of thumb for a small business to evaluate whether something would be too much risk. I know each business has its own story and its unique needs, but certainly there are general guidelines on what percentage to spend on rent/mortgage, employees, equipment/materials etc.  

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#24) On December 16, 2010 at 12:47 PM, lemoneater (88.51) wrote:

Counting "carrying too much debt" we are up to 7 reasons.

8. Creating low morale should be another one. About 17 years ago I used to work at a Sears store in the home fashions department--towels, small kitchen appliances, etc. At least once a day and sometimes even more frequently I would have to tell a customer, "I'm sorry we don't have that [mixer] in stock." I was embarrassed and frustrated with a chronically low inventory, because I remembered when the "Sear's Has Everything" slogan used to be true. We were to encourage the customer that we could order it, but who wants to wait two weeks for something they can get somewhere else right off the shelf.

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#25) On December 16, 2010 at 3:38 PM, mtf00l (47.57) wrote:

A suggestion for the small town bank closing for lunch could have something to do with the following.

I worked for a company that fell upon hard financial times.  We employees that understood things knew to go to the bank as soon as we got our checks.  That would be the bank the funds were drawn on because after the first few payroll checks were cashed one of two things would happen,  The bank would run low of funds or the companies account at the bank would run out of funds.

By closing for lunch it would cause some to miss the window as they would be off on other task and might take days to get back to the bank.

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#26) On December 16, 2010 at 4:20 PM, lemoneater (88.51) wrote:

"Closed for lunch--avoiding a run on funds!"

I guess FDIC has prevented such dodges from being necessary.

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#27) On December 16, 2010 at 4:49 PM, Mary953 (39.90) wrote:

Where would you put this one, lemoneater?

I worked in a start-up business for a short time (about a year) along with a few other people.  We were all older than the young owner who was starting the business and we had all 'retired' from other jobs.  We didn't mind the extreme low pay for highly technical work because to some degree, we felt invested in the success of the young owner. He was friendly and reminded us of our children.  We added to our own job descriptions, planning marketing campaigns and doing other activities to help him get a good start.  He did not see a need for spending money on marketing which concerned us.

He was very appreciative the first 6 months or so.  Then, while still paying us close to minimum wage, he bought himself a Lexus and some very expensive toys.  He did not raise wages (after all, we could get by on other income sources) nor did he plow any money back into his business.  Within 6 more months, his older supportive staff had left for much higher paying jobs and he had the staff that he was paying for.  Another business that did not succeed.  Poor money management or just bad judgement in several areas of business?

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#28) On December 17, 2010 at 10:35 AM, lemoneater (88.51) wrote:

Mary, it sounds like the business failed from multiple reasons with a single cause--the owner!

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#29) On December 17, 2010 at 10:53 AM, lemoneater (88.51) wrote:

We will call this 9. Ignoring wise advice or The Rehoboam Syndrome. For those not familiar with the story of King Solomon's son here is the link. http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=1%20Kings%2012:%201-14&version=NIV1984

An unwillingless to benefit from the greater experience of others has sunk many a business. Self-reliance is wonderful; stupidity is not!

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#30) On December 17, 2010 at 10:56 AM, lemoneater (88.51) wrote:

In turn, the owner's stupid, stubborn, and selfish behavior created low morale in everyone.

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#31) On December 17, 2010 at 11:14 AM, lemoneater (88.51) wrote:

It also sounds like he had no awareness that companies start life as invisible and without proper marketing/advertising can remain invisible for the whole of their short existence.

So far I see a touch of 2. If we broaden it to mean company invisibility of any kind.

Also there was a generous amount of 8.Plenty of low morale.

And it was a textbook perfect illustration of 9. Ignoring wise advice. 

Anyone spot something else that I missed in Mary's real life example?

 

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#32) On December 24, 2010 at 12:31 PM, lemoneater (88.51) wrote:

10. Assume failure. It is frustrating how some business seem to run on the assumption that nobody is going to buy their products so they don't make enough products or keep enough inventory for the customers who come to buy.

My husband went out to get a Christmas Bread today to have for breakfast tomorrow, but the place which sold it was already out--they hadn't planned on the demand. If you are open Christmas Eve and sell delicious baked goods assume that last minute shoppers will wish to pick up treats they haven't had time to make themselves.

 

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#33) On December 30, 2010 at 4:08 PM, lemoneater (88.51) wrote:

11. Pick a dishonest business partner. Sometimes one can be perfectly enjoyable in a social setting, but not reliable for business. It is hard to be a good judge of character, but all too often who one picks as partner is crucial to the success/survival of the business.

As part of my job sometimes I have to call customers whose credit cards have declined and ask for alternate forms of payment. Once a customer said, I'm not surprised you called my partner left with $60,000 of our money and the company's cards are all declining. 

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#34) On December 31, 2010 at 3:15 PM, lemoneater (88.51) wrote:

For my friends out there who are small business owners I wish you success.

Have a Happy New Year!

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#35) On January 05, 2011 at 12:17 PM, lemoneater (88.51) wrote:

12. Inability to adapt to a changing marketplace and handle competition. I would have to say that is the reason many of the Depression Glass companies went under. Once the Depression was over cheap glassware was not as in demand and some of them didn't seem to have the flexibility to upgrade their quality or change their product lines to better compete and serve their customers changing needs. Perhaps this could be more colorfully known as the horse and buggy principle. Keep growing and learning so your company doesn't become obsolete. A few did adapt to changing times. Corning Glassware is still around. It was quite a change from making kitchen ware to fiber optic cables, and glass for LCD screens. 

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#36) On January 05, 2011 at 3:56 PM, lemoneater (88.51) wrote:

13. Not providing for a rise in cost in raw materials or energy needed to make a product. Some of the glass companies had to leave an area when fuel was no longer affordable. 

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#37) On January 05, 2011 at 4:01 PM, lemoneater (88.51) wrote:

I guess why some companies buy futures on commodities or energy is to prevent costs from going out of control.

There are so many factors to consider when running a business that it can be mind boggling. At least the kind of company whether retail or service or manufacturing or a combination of all of the above can somewhat narrow down what potential pitfalls a company can have. 

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#38) On January 07, 2011 at 2:35 PM, lemoneater (88.51) wrote:

This really turned out to be a more involved topic than I thought it would be. No wonder why people get degrees in business. Success is not accidental!

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#39) On January 28, 2011 at 12:31 AM, Mstinterestinman (35.43) wrote:

The one example is just stupidity if you can afford to reward the people that are helping your business grow and make them happy. Look at Berkshire Hathaway and Nucor a great company will treat its employees and shareholders like business partners and this helps makes it great. Yes I'm learning..lol

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#40) On February 01, 2011 at 10:03 AM, Gemini846 (89.64) wrote:

Your shrimp story is interesting. During peak Crawfish season my friends purchased some from a guy who brought them from LA overnight by truck. He said he could sell them in a few hours and then head straight back for more. Sounds like your guy was in the wrong market.

"The building" is an intersting concept. We had a plaza like that where I live that couldn't keep thier main storefront filled. It was 3 different stores in 5 years. Home Depot went in there and they've been exploding that strip for the better part of two decades. The restaurants in front of the strip haven't fared as well. Applebees has been there for about 10 years but the other sites have had constant churn. They just leveled the corner and put in an IHOP so we'll see how that does.  

I'm researching locations right now for a speciality retail store and I don't want to over pay for space. The current revenue stream is completely online the retail front is just expansion and marketing is completely unrelated to location as long as lighting is good and there are some late night food places near by. 80% of my "walk in" business would be 6-10pm or on weekends.

Are there real-estate brokers that deal in commercial like that, o do I have to keep calling all these strip malls and driving around after 9pm to see what the lights are like? 

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